Candle in the wind…
There are certain dead people that have retained celebrity status, maybe even becoming more popular in death. This group of people may illicit some strong reactions from you because it’s likely that you have come to hold them in high regard. But I ask, why? Our society has been fascinated with these people for a long time, but is the fascination and attention warranted? Are these people really so special? What exactly did they do during their lives that would catapult them into the stratosphere of icon status? Why are we drawn to their images. What do they represent?
On Pinterest you’ll see hundreds of photos of the following people. Why does the public, years later, still get excited by these individual lives? 
- Grace Kelly – Actress, married royalty, had children, died in car crash at age 52
- Jackie Kennedy / Jacqueline Onassis – A woman of privilege, married a man who would become president, fashion icon, husband assassinated, re-married tycoon, became a respectable journalist/editor, died from cancer at age 64.
- Marilyn Monroe – plucked from obscurity and was transformed into a starlet, battled with alcohol and drugs, deep emotional problems, affair with a president, tragic and mysterious death -age 36
- Princess Diana – Child/Woman of privilege, married a prince, had children, divorced cheating husband, died in horrific car crash at age 36
- James Dean – talented Hollywood actor, died in a car crash at age 34
- John F. Kennedy Junior– Child of privilege, father assassinated, attends law school, fails to pass the bar 2 times- passes it on third try in 1990, many famous girl friends, becomes a pilot and starts a political magazine, dies in a plane crash (age 39) on his way to his cousin’s wedding.
On close inspection all of the above listed people were very attractive, famous and wealthy. Was there something extraordinary about them that would cause generation after generation to idolize them? Is it because they touched the sun for a brief moment and fell back down to earth in some tragic way? Do we want/need to feel connected to them?
Thoughts, feelings?
Grippy,
I will not comment on two of your posts in one day. I’ll be back tomorrow.
Le Clown
I’ll await your return. This post is sort of heavy anyway, I don’t know what got into me?
Grippy,
The size of my package is weighing on you.
Le Clown
You have no idea. It entered my dream world last night, I wasn’t going to tell you, but I thought you should know.
Grippy,
You lucky woman.
Le Clown
Just so you both know, I’m barfing all over the place because of these comments and the infamous picture.
These comments are beyond barfy. Please know that Le Clown is stalking me.
This one’s a thinker. There seems to be a pattern here too. I wonder if we might see this in the future.
Brother Jon – Plucked from obscurity and transformed into a fabulous blogger. Dropped out of college at the age of 22. Died while competing in a doughnut eating contest at the age of 37.
Looks like I’ve got a few more years. I often wonder why some of these people are held so high in our eyes. I don’t think I can answer this. They weren’t exactly anything special, until we made them that way.
I agree. It’s a question with psychological implications. Why are we so drawn to people like this when the reality is they didn’t really do anything to deserve such an elevated status? Maybe because they’re good looking?
If that’s the case, then Bro Jon, the fabulous blogger will be next in line. : )
I must forever stay away from doughnuts now. This is going to be tough.
I think it’s because all of these people represented the ideals of their time: they were beautiful, but some of them introduced a new view on beauty. They were the people everyone wanted to be, and then they died young, which no one really wants. I guess many people feel like their lives were too short for their beauty and success.
Does this make sense somehow?
It makes total sense. It’s like we hitch our own dreams and sense of self to them, and then when they die we feel devastated because we’ve somehow connected ourselves to them.
I can’t believe you’re still letting Le Clown comment here, Grippy. You’re a good person.
Your post today is a brain-burner for sure. It’s true, the fact that they died young isn’t really what rivets people, it’s the fact that they died young and attractive, many of them having done relatively little of any real consequence. I think of other people who died untimely deaths—Jim Henson comes to mind immediately—they aren’t given icon status like Marilyn or James Dean. I guess it’s the combination of the youth, the looks, the glamour & mystique, and the sudden death that make them more “memorable” than others who also died prematurely.
So much food for thought today, Grippy!
I know, I’m like a saint when it comes to humoring Le Clown.
I wasn’t going to post this heavy topic today, especially with all those questions, but it’s something that I think about from time to time. I’m especially intrigued with the idea that younger generations are worshipping people they know very little about. Are they getting a love of Jackie Kennedy from their parents? Weird, right?
I think you’re right, it’s like a combo platter or perfect storm of glamour, fortune, success, failure/ tragedy and accessibility. Maybe on some level we try to identify with them and then when they suddenly die we’re bonded to them through tragedy?
My son Adam was about a week old when, John John Kennedy/Junior died in the plane crash. It was all over the news. Day and night. Night and day. What gives? Pre-death, John John and wife were either fighting with the paparazzi or fighting with each other. Just another over-privileged blue blood from Massachusetts, flying an airplane in pea soup in July. Oops.
Ok, who’s Le Clown?
Don’t start me on Le Clown… I’m barely shaking off my last encounter.
Yeah, I remember Diana and John F. Kennedy Junior the most. I was very plugged into Diana’s life, “The lamb to slaughter” scenario with her crap marriage. When she died it felt unreal. I stayed up all night and through the next several days in disbelief and I don’t know why? It was like my sad friend died. And John John… let’s just say he was nothing short of physical perfection. Greek God status – very manly, indeed. But his death with his wife in that little plane… it was unreal. You don’t expect bad things to happen to people of their ilk — and when they do it’s like, really? You can’t wrap your head around it. It suddenly makes them very mortal and fragile.
Fame is really weird, especially when a famous person dies. In a way, you have to suspend your disbelief that these individuals are people in the first place, because you’re likely only going to see them on a screen or in print, never in person. But then, when they die, it proves that they were indeed always just people. But we still have that feeling of loss, despite the fact that we never even knew them personally.
And now I will go watch Nyan Cat, as my brain is oozing out my ears.
Hahaha! I know, sorry. It’s such a heavy post with all kinds of psychological implications. It’s torturous, really.
I totally agree with you. It feels like they’re somehow above the human condition, like life can’t touch or tarnish them. Then when something tragic happens our perspective is jarred. We’re reminded of just how fragile we are.
I’m not overly keen on the idolisation of actors, and actresses, really. They’re nothing more than entertainers.
What about when they marry royalty or presidents or are the off-spring of that pairing. (Diana, Jackie Kennedy, John Junior…) I really don’t worship entertainers either – I’m with you on that. But why do you suppose so many follow this bunch? What’s the draw?
Yeah, some people seem to be famous, just for being famous.
Some of them are more popular in death, than when they were alive, which is true for Princess Diana to a huge degree. It’s just weird.
Maybe because through them we can pull ourselves out of the averageness of obscurity and connect with people who have lived among the extreme. As if finding a parallel between ourselves and someone rich, famous and beautiful it can transfer some of those qualities to ourselves. Also, pretty!
I think you’re right. They elevate our sense of self. We root for them in their fame, success, beauty, talent (if they have any). Those things seem so removed from our own existence. When they take a tumble and fall in some tragic way it shakes us to the core. When we find out they’re fragile and very mortal just like us, the tragedy is magnified?
Yeah, the fact that they’re all good looking adds another element, for sure. : )
It seems fame and fortune brings an early death to a lot of people
Interesting and probably true. That’s a huge price to pay for fame and fortune. How many people would choose to live that kind of life if they knew it would end early?
I think Elvis should make your list. He was the first wigger.
I’m more interested in people who become more famous after they die. Bill Hicks is the only one who comes to mind. Christopher Columbus too sort of since nobody believed him and he died “penniless.” When I was younger I used to think penniless meant they cut off his penis.
Wait. That is good stuff, Tim. OMG. Lily will like that.
Elvis is interesting because he fits the profile for part of it. He ACTUALLY had talent, let’s be honest. He also went through a fat, Vegas, polyester phase before he died which caused him to seem much more human — the spell was broken. When that happens people tend to stop the clamoring. I think he’s bigger in death, maybe? Or maybe the young Elvis is bigger in death?
If the spell gets broken and you become too mortal, people tend to stop the worship.
This is a good one! They all died young so it’s as if they were frozen in time. They died tragically which brings an epic quality to their existence. They become gods. Though Elizabeth Taylor was beautiful, we got to see her deteriorate, so her legacy is a little different.
Thanks, Sandee. This is just what I was telling Mooselicker, above! It’s like if the spell gets broken, as it did for Elvis, Elizabeth and Michael Jackson, then they return to a mortal state. People will mourn but the real big time worship seems reserved for the gods who retain that status. I think that’s true. wow. all my questions are getting answered. Thanks!
It seems to me they all died before they got fat and/or overly wrinkly. Now if Elvis would have died in the 1950’s when he was still thin and handsome, he’d be up there on that list. But the way in which he died was such a nonevent! I guess I wouldn’t even say these people were attractive as much as they were photogenic. Because I once heard Jackie O described as a praying mantis by someone who met her due to her eyes being so far apart. And then I guess there is also the fact that they were all charismatic or at least they seemed to be from a distance or on paper! 😀
Your comment is EXACTLY how I feel. They’re all photogenic. Jackie O was never a beauty, ever. I think her status elevated her so somehow people saw the clothes and the setting and wanted to attribute beauty to her list of qualities. (Her voice was also bizarro – that little girl whispery voice… it was almost scary.) haha!
But you’re exactly right about these people getting plucked at the height of their popularity when they were still gods. Had Elvis not had the fat vegas years, he would have been in the group too, definitely. Same with Elizabeth Taylor.
If the spell gets broken, and they show their human side, we don’t clamor in the same way. Jackie O and Grace Kelly kept a low profile, so they lived longer but because they were rarely spotted we remember them in their younger years.
I do think we attribute qualities or characteristics to them that we want or need them to have. Marilyn Monroe had major mental health issues and was so needy and desperate, yet people saw what they wanted to see.
PS. Did you see that Harper was back! Yeah! Someone else to make us laugh!
Lisa, I think it’s the youth/beauty thing. These people (although not all) died when they were fairly young but the images we still see of them are when they’re young and beautiful. I just watched a show the other day about Marilyn Monroe and this photographer spotlighted her intelligence instead of her beauty saying that she was really a shrewd business woman and was always upset because no one took her talent as an actress seriously (she constantly compared herself to Liz Taylor). Grace Kelly symbolizes grace and beauty. James Dean and John Kennedy were the good-lucking “bad boy” types and Jackie O’ — well she was married to JFK and seemed the maintain her dignity and grace despite what her husband’s philandering ways. Princess Diana — I think many “felt” for her because the media portrayed her an innocent who fell for a prince who just didn’t love her back.
I guess society idolizes the famous but they’re just people that just happened to have their lives, ups, downs and everything else on display for the world to see. Many people are kind of starstruck (I’ve never been) but there’s always that.
I love when you get deep btw. You do funny and deep equally wonderful!!
Aww, Brig, you’re so kind. Thank you.
I’ve thought about this question for a long time and I’ve always had theories. I think posting about this topic and seeing what everyone has to say has been helpful.
I think all of these people had this meteoric rise, whether it was through, marriage, talent, appearance, fame, etc. they seemed beyond the human condition, golden. Then when they died early and tragically they cemented that status BUT at the same time, reminded us that they actually were human! It’s a shock when someone who seems to be living an existence so removed from our own, comes crashing down.
I think Linda and Sandee pointed out that Elvis and Elizabeth Taylor, slipped and revealed moments of humanness, they showed their flaws and so they lost some of their status as gods. Sure, people still idolize Elvis, he actually was talented, but he would have had a greater spot in the world of icons had he died when he was young, – before the fat, polyester, vegas days. As Linda points out, it was a non-event.
There’s a book called “Goddess,” about Marilyn Monroe which reveals just how emotionally ill she was. She was extremely needy, depressed, anxious and addicted. In the book they said she had been diagnosed as a Borderline Personality Disorder – which is a pervasive mental illness. It’s very serious. The public had no clue to the degree to which she was suffering. People just projected their own ideas of who she was onto her. Talk about tragic….
Lisa, I just typed a novel back and it disappeared. If I can remember it all, I agree about Elvis and Liz Taylor. Weird story, my sis came to visit me here and she told this guy at a bagel shop that she was visiting from Memphis. He LOVED Elvis, this nice NYorker and gave her a dozen bagels. So Elvis’ influence was far-reaching. I got to see him in concert when I was young and even during his “fat” unhealthy days, his voice never left him. He could sing certain songs and the hair would stand up on the back of your neck. I’ve never been to Graceland but I hear it gets THOUSANDS of visitors from all over the world.
And I read the same about Marilyn Monroe. That she was mentally ill and that her mom was too. Mental illness can be hereditary, right? I had a friend whose Dad was scizophrenic (wrong spelling) and she was always terrified she would be.
Anyway, sorry for the ramble. I loved your post!!!
Yes! I think Elvis and Elizabeth Taylor were UBER talented and so they were idolized/respected, rightfully so, for REAL talent. They fell a little and exposed a fragile side but I don’t know a single person who doesn’t respect their immense talent and see them as worthy American icons that influenced future generations.
The others simply didn’t have THAT kind of talent.
Wouldn’t it be fun for all of us to meet at Graceland? Wouldn’t that be cool? I’ve never been.
Good grief, forgive the typos. I’m typing too fast, but I think you get it anyway!!
Oh yeah, I got it and look, I typed a novel in return! haha! What’s wrong with me!!!??
Yes, it would be fun to meet at Graceland. In the jungle room. Oh and bring your pics of your Dad who you said reminds you of Robert Redford (mine does too)….maybe we are sisters….hmmmm.
:). I can leave an emoticon here and feel safe.
All emoticons are welcomed! The Robert Redford thing totally bonds us. I don’t think many can make that claim. haha!
I like this post! You pretty much hit the nail on the head when you said “they touched the sun for a brief moment and fell back down to earth in some tragic way”. That’s pretty much it.
Why do we watch the Kardashians? It’s not because we like them. It’s because they have money and cool lives, and drama. People like a good story. And there’s nothing like a tragic story to keep people talking for years and years.
Yeah, I didn’t want to get people too riled but it’s not like any of these lives are special, as in Mother Theresa or Nelson Mandela special. I guess we don’t see pictures of them because they’re not glamorous. It’s sad isn’t it? Our society is so twisted. People are more plugged into the Kardashians than they are with people dedicating their lives to bettering humanity. Oh wait, that’s me. haha! JK!
I have nothing to add to this fabulous conversation you have sparked here Ms. Grippy. You write so well.. I agree with Brigitte… witty, funny and intelligence at its best. Carry on(not that you need me to tell you that)
You make it work(channeling Tim Gunn here)
rambling on… it has been a doozy of a day. Thanks for ending it with great reading. Now I am going to wax poetic..haa
Thanks, kind Audra. I’m glad you got through the dooziness of your day and still have time and energy to put beautiful thoughts together.
I look forward to tomorrow’s offering. : )
i still recall the morning I read the headlines that Princess Diana was killed. My husband 9Ex) and I both cried as if a family member died. I think we grieved because we felt cheated. We wanted her to do more, let us keep sharing in her public world and then the children she left behind. It really was grief. The same with JFK, Jr.. it was awful.. I’m not a big celebrity fanatic but some people in the public eye really tug at my heart..
I felt the exact same way with Princess Diana. I felt like she was my friend, which says a lot about her. It felt like she was trying to do good, change things, and be accessible and I think the public picked up on her vulnerability. When you add in her young boys that you know she was crazy about, it was just devastating.
JFK junior felt like nothing bad could happen to him, like he was above the human condition… I don’t know why i would feel that way since his family has had so much tragedy. Maybe his youth, good looks, and legacy, so much potential?
When we identify with someone’s struggles/ life, it’s harder to lose them.
I don’t have an answer in general for the fascination with the rich and famous but I would say all of these people had an extraordinary degree of charisma. For those of us who are old enough, I think we fell in love with JFK Jr. when he was three and saluting his father’s casket and then we followed his life till everyone felt like they knew him. And expected him to do something amazing. And for Princess Diana, while I thought a lot of the obsession because of fashion and prettiness was silly but I gave her credit for using her position to do a lot of good. For most people is it all just a fascination with wealth/power/beauty? I don’t really know.
I do think there’s some fantasy in there, as simple mortals we like to pretend and imagine our lives as these privileged people. I also think we look for ways to identify with them and then when something tragic happens, we feel strangely plugged in to the pain of it all. If they didn’t have fame, none of these people would be extraordinary in their lives. People work for good causes all the time. None of these people have accomplishments that are off the charts. It’s always strange to me how we clamor around their images as if they’re super human.
Don’t get me wrong, I loved Diana and felt sick for a long time after she died. It’s just a good question with lots of psychological implications.
The Kennedy family seems to die horrifically – I think they are cursed. Interestingly – a large majority died in car accidents. I don’t know what it all means but ‘beauty’, ‘charisma’, ‘fame’, ‘money’ seem to be a common thread. But like you said in a response – they were none of them extraordinary because of accomplishments.
That’s right and that’s why it makes me wonder how much we project our own hopes, dreams, desires, fantasy, onto them? They’re just people, after-all, whose circumstances momentarily caused a big white light to be shined on them. I think living in the public eye and having expectations placed on you must feel like a prison. They look so free with their wealth and fame and glamor but deep inside I’m sure they’re lonely and anxious, always having to turn it on and off when out in public. That would be very draining, I think.
Yes – I’m stunned every time I think X is perfect and I find out that my perception is so wrong…
I am also annoyed when people refer to sports figures as ‘heroes’ – how is scoring a touchdown make you a ‘hero’? Our society is completely wacked when it comes to fame.
That’s such a good point. Their salaries are insane to match the over the top accolades. I hate it when actors refer to each other as “a genius” or say, he or she is so “brave.” haha! It’s laughable. Our society is so screwed up!
I am impressed by people because of their accomplishments (Marilyn, James Dean), not their celebrity (Jackie, JFK Jr (though I don’t know enough about him to know if he accomplished, or just cashed in on Dad’s name))
And by that criteria, a lot of people who impress me aren’t in the public eye so much.
I agree although let’s be honest, Marilyn wasn’t exactly actress extraordinaire, right? You’re right about the others just being born and lucking into a privileged life. And yet people adore them like they’re gods.
I’m more impressed with the unknown good deed doers, and the Mother Theresa, Nelson Mandela types, to be sure.
True, she wasn’t going to win any Oscars.
But she did have a goal that she chased and to some degree achieved.
I have mixed feelings about Mother Theresa. I’ve heard some unsettling things since her passing.
hahaha! I think I heard she had some botox work done at the end there, which makes me think none of us really knew her.
I have never understood this need to idolize people, but I know it’s common. Where are Elvis and Michael Jackson??? :)Angie
Elvis, though still adored, had shown a very human flaw. He was taking drugs, overweight, and generally unhealthy. Michael Jackson was completely drugged out. I think the others that I mentioned some how managed to escape showing their human side and flaws and therefore retained their mythical status.